🚨Exclusive: Sheryl McCollum on Katie Janness Case & Animal Trafficking Ep 158

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Read the video transcript blog below of the interview with Sheryl Mac McCollum, Director of The Cold Case Investigative Research Institute. 

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Anne Angelo Webb: [00:00:00] Usually, when we discuss the human animal bond, we celebrate the joy, companionship, and unconditional love that pets bring into our lives. However, tonight’s conversation takes a bit of a turn as we delve into the tragic intersection of violence against both humans and animals. We’ll be examining the case of Katie Janess and her beloved dog Bowie.

who were brutally unalived in Atlanta’s Piedmont Park nearly three years ago this coming July. Our guest renowned forensic expert Cheryl “Mac” McCollum will illuminate the investigative challenges surrounding this unsolved case. We’re going to pack it in tonight because we’re also going to explore the potential links between animal trafficking and human trafficking networks.

And this discussion is [00:01:00] crucial in raising awareness and seeking justice for all victims, whether they walk on two legs or four. Our guest, Cheryl McCollum, is not only a seasoned crime scene investigator and founder of the Cold Case Investigative Research Institute. But also the esteemed host of the highly acclaimed podcast Zone 7, writer for Crime Online, forensic and crime scene expert for Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, and Cheryl holds a master’s degree in criminal justice with an emphasis on policing.

And she is also the co author of the textbook Cold Case Pathways to Justice. Welcome, Cheryl.

Sheryl McCollum: Thank you so much. I’ve been looking forward to this, honey.

Anne Angelo Webb: Oh, believe me, I’ve been looking forward to it. So, and I’m sure our audiences too, we have some people coming into the chat. So if you’re new here, though, I just to let you know, I’m Angela Webb, owner of Animal Intuitive Academy and Intuitive Touch Animal Care.

For over 20 years, I’ve worn two hats, passionate animal communicator, massage and acupressure practitioner and licensed [00:02:00] clinical social worker. And here we learn how to connect with animals on a deeper level. explore holistic care options, support pet parents through their journey, and interview experts in animal care and advocacy.

And I just want to mention that, as a quick disclaimer, please be advised that this episode does involve discussion of human and animal mistreatment, so just take that into account if you’re going to continue watching, and if you have any little ones around. So, and I just want to say hello Mel Mack, thank you so much, she’s our wonderful mod in the chat.

If you have questions, please post them in the chat. And if you have questions or comments later, we love to see your comments. I answer all comments and we appreciate you just, just being here. So for the topics this evening, um, we’re going to get to those, but Cheryl, please just share with us what is the Cole Case Investigative Research Institute?

Sheryl McCollum: It’s a nonprofit that we started to take on unsolved homicide, missing persons, and kidnapping [00:03:00] cases where law enforcement just needed some help. There’s departments all across the country that don’t have a cold case squad. They don’t have specialized units. And we have over 600 experts in every discipline you can imagine, as well as college students that assist on these cases for free.

Anne Angelo Webb: Oh, wow. That’s real. That’s really cool. Um, and I think you’re also part of the cold case, uh, found foundation, right? Yes, absolutely. Okay. Yeah.

Sheryl McCollum: Honored to be a part of that group. You’re talking about people from. you know, John Douglas, you know, just everybody you’ve ever heard of as a part of it. And when you put that type of just brain power on the case, you can really make some moves.

No doubt about it.

Anne Angelo Webb: Incredible. And we actually had some of your colleagues on earlier this year. Gary Boccato and Burgess and Catherine Ransom were here. So it’s absolutely to have you come on as well. I’m so excited. So I did talk about this case, um, a while [00:04:00] back and it’s been a long time though. So I’m very excited to have you here as a forensic expert.

Um, so I figured let’s start there and, you know, you’ve shared your thoughts with, with media sources that you, including that crime online, we mentioned. Um, so, but for people who aren’t familiar with this case, I’m just going to give you a quick overview. Um, just to tell you a little bit, Katie Janass was an avid reader who collected books.

She had taught herself to play the guitar and had recently, before all this happened, ventured into writing songs. Um, by the way, if you can hear any noise outside, our next door neighbor, who also has a German shepherd, is, has a trainer over. So if you hear that, they’re They’re doing some exposure training.

I think it sounds like it’s like a party out there. Um, so, so Catherine Janess, Katie, as she was also known, was planning for a future with the love of her life, Emma [00:05:00] Clark. They had been together for seven years and considered themselves married. Jeunesse left with Katie left with her dog Bowie for a walk shortly after 10 p.

m. on the night of July 28th, 2021. And Katie’s partner Emma said she had come by sometime after that to the restaurant where Emma worked, Henry’s Midtown Tavern on 10th Street to say hi as she was going along on this walk with Bowie. So when Katie didn’t return home after the walk, Emma went looking for them using the find my phone app.

To help her and discovered their bodies near the park entrance. The, um, officers went to the entrance of Piedmont Park at 10th Street and Charles Allen Drive around 1:00 AM and on July 28th after getting that call from Emma. So that’s kind of where we leave off. Um, and this is, this is a case that’s familiar with you ’cause it’s kind of in your, your territory, right?

Yes. Yes. [00:06:00] Yeah. Okay.

Sheryl McCollum: So, I’ve walked the crime scene. I’ve had the chance to speak with Emma on more than one occasion. And so, I mean, I’m, I’m as familiar as I can be without being actually owned the case for some reason.

Anne Angelo Webb: Okay. And that’s amazing. Um, so. Yeah. I mean, there’s a lot here and it’s just, it’s so awful because of what happened.

I mean, I, I don’t want to talk too much. I’ve already said so much, but, um, you know, they were unalive with, uh, a knife, um, over 50 stab wounds and on, on, uh, Katie’s body and then also Bowie. So. Uh, there’s a little bit of information that’s been released, although it kind of seems like not a ton. It seems like they’re kind of, they keep, they’re keeping a lot of this to themselves.

Um, which I think is

Sheryl McCollum: the right call. We’ll get into that, but I think that’s the right call.

Anne Angelo Webb: Okay. Um, she did have defensive wounds on her [00:07:00] hands and the letters F, A, and T were carved into her torso. Um, So, so let’s just go from there. What, what do you think? Does, do you feel like this was a random attack?

Was it targeted?

Sheryl McCollum: Hmm. I think you have to start with the actual park. So if I could just kind of paint a picture for everybody. So this is basically our central park in Atlanta. It’s beautiful. It’s got lots of green space. Everybody goes there. Picnics, they show movies, um, people exercise, people get engaged there.

Like Piedmont Park is central and it’s used in a multiple, you know, type of ways for different things. Not just, you know, people that are from Atlanta and live near there, but people visit there because this is a somewhat famous park. When you drive up to Charles [00:08:00] Drive and You know, the park is there and there’s some gates and the gates are open.

I mean, it’s accessible to people and there’s Katie at the crosswalk away from the park, so that’s when she’s leaving the restaurant after she visited with Emma for a little while. And that’s her and Bowie walking toward Piedmont park. So once they get out of that crosswalk, that’s the last camera that picks her up.

So we have real time of when she was in that crosswalk. So we can say when Emma said, yes, she dropped by. We talked for a little while and she and Bowie were going to go for a walk. Once I got off work, we were going to meet at the house. So real time, we know exactly where she was and then you can walk it yourself.

She should have been in the park in less than seven minutes. I mean, it was not far at all. Even if she stopped to talk to some other people. The thing about the park, even if it’s technically closed, there are still people that utilize the park. It can be a cut through [00:09:00] getting from restaurants to, you know, apartments and homes.

Um, again, people that exercise it’s, it’s a wide open paths. I mean, it’s just a beautiful place to be. Even in the midnight hour, it is still illuminated enough. You can see, you could read a newspaper. It’s not like you couldn’t see anything. Now there are pockets where if somebody wanted to hide in tree lines or bushes, they could do that and be unseen.

But again, this killer didn’t do that. This killer came at her and Bowie as soon as she almost crossed that threshold to go into the park. He did not wait for her to get deep inside the park where nobody else was around. So again, right there on Charles drive, you’ve got. Apartments and townhomes and freestanding, you know, dwellings all around.

So you’re not alone [00:10:00] at the intersection where she was at all. So as soon as she gets into the park, I believe, obviously, I think everybody would agree that Bowie was killed first, because he’s found first right there. I think when Bowie is killed and attacked, I think she ran, but he caught up to her.

fairly quickly and where she was attacked. Again, it’s not like she was drug into this wooded area. Anybody that would have walked by could have easily seen what was occurring. It just so happens in that moment there wasn’t anybody.

Anne Angelo Webb: It’s incredible that they took that kind of a risk, the attacker.

Sheryl McCollum: Right.

So again, that tells you a lot about the attacker. And so I think that’s why the FBI’s BAU was brought in so quickly because they needed somebody to explain to us. Is this a visionary killer? Is this [00:11:00] a control freak? Is this somebody that’s a sexual sadist? Like who do we have on our hands? Is this a serial person or was this targeted?

Did somebody target her? So you have to look at all those. So for the folks listening, that may not be in law enforcement. Sometimes we do what’s called a parallel investigation. So at the same time we are looking at Katie’s life, was this domestic? Where was Emma? Was this somebody that she dated a year ago?

That’s been stalking her. And she’s told some close friends. Was this somebody, because she was in the service industry that would show up at her restaurant that she didn’t feel exactly safe around. Um, so you have to look at that. What is her life? Does she owe somebody money? Is she a drug addict? Um, does she have a job that Emma didn’t know anything about that put her at some type of risk or danger?

At the same time, you’re looking at an unknown, [00:12:00] unknown to her, unknown to law enforcement. Was this a serial killer? Is this somebody that’s a rapist and this is the first time he’s ever killed? It doesn’t look that way. But again, you have to ask yourself the domestic and the unknown. So that’s what Atlanta was doing very quickly.

And to their credit. They brought in experts almost immediately.

Anne Angelo Webb: Yeah, when I saw the FBI was at the, um, the autopsy actually. So they did, they brought him in right away. It sounds like, um,

Sheryl McCollum: But it’s important because what do those letters mean? I mean, she clearly wasn’t fat. So did it mean that is this person delusional?

Does this person just hate women? So that was just a. a negative thing that almost any woman would be upset being called. They took extra time and that’s always critical. So 50 stab wounds don’t happen in 30 seconds. [00:13:00] Carving those letters don’t happen in two minutes. None of those things were necessary to kill her.

You don’t have to stab somebody 50 times. So why? Why that many times? Why those letters carved where they were in the order that they were. Do the letters stand for something? Is this something that the killer has in his head like a D. T. K. Or is this something that it is fat? And he was just calling her that, like calling her a whore, just saying something derogatory again.

That’s why you need to be a you. There was a lot here to unpack. It is rare that somebody would Murder somebody and their dog. So that’s going to get your attention. It’s rare. They’re going to be stabbed 50 times. It’s rare that they’re going to have something carved in their body. So all of those, just those three things should get your attention.

But then when you factor in this was quasi in [00:14:00] the wide open, her body was not hidden. She wasn’t buried. She wasn’t covered. He made no attempt to hide her at all. When Emma got there, Emma immediately saw Bowie, walked a very, you know, short distance and then there was Katie.

Anne Angelo Webb: I can’t even imagine. Um, so, a couple things.

Unfortunately, people might be wondering, well, weren’t there, there were no cameras? Well, there weren’t. Unfortunately, apparently a lot of cameras were inactive. They had cameras, but they were inactive due to outdated technology, um, which is really a shame. Apparently they’ve since updated them, but a little late.

Um, so it, I mean, what, what do you make of this? I mean, the fact that they, he, I mean, it’s, it’s just, does it tell you the person was potentially psychotic or on [00:15:00] drugs? Like they, they would take all these risks, the dog. Right.

Sheryl McCollum: And, and again, I went there and I walked it at the exact same time of day because I wanted to see how many people are, you know, out and about, what can I see?

If I were to scream, could somebody hear me? The first thing that just kind of blew my mind is the amount of activity. Even after this homicide, it didn’t like the park was vacant and it like people were too scared. I’m telling you that park is active all the time. People bike and walk and jog and, you know, like I said, social activities, whether they’re meeting friends there to have a picnic or they’re getting engaged or they’re just, you know, having a bottle of wine with each other.

Right across the street are private homes on almost all sides. There are roadways that again, Stayed pretty active. [00:16:00] So if, if anybody were to fall off their bike and get hurt, that’d be quick help. I mean, there’s somebody there when Karen Greer and I were there the first time at 1 15 in the morning, we could hear people right down the street at a bar.

It was open air, like they’re on the patio, but we could hear them. So if we had started screaming, they would be able to hear us.

Anne Angelo Webb: Yeah.

Sheryl McCollum: Mm hmm.

Anne Angelo Webb: And so if you probably, I mean, I can imagine if you’re running and You’re just trying to get away. Maybe you don’t even scream cause you’re just shocked and running.

And you don’t even get that out. Um, so at this point it, there really hasn’t been an update. I mean, last summer, I think it was, there was, um, it wasn’t really an update. I mean, the, the Atlanta PD. Just said, you know, we’re still looking for, and by the way, if anyone’s look, you know, watching this on, listening to this on the podcast, [00:17:00] um, there is a tip line.

I have it up on the screen, but it’s 4 0 4 5 7 7 tips. Um, or you can text CS as in Sam, a as in apple, and the tip two crimes. numerically, C R I M E S, but the numerals on your phone. And they apparently give you a code or something like that, so you can do it anonymously. You can use these numbers or do this this way.

And, or you can go to stopcrimeatl. org. And at the time I saw this, it still says there’s a 2, 000 reward. So, um, Yeah, so Melmac is asking, um, attacked. Sorry, that comes up right at the wrong place. Attacked from behind, she’s asking. Um, and this is obviously Katie and Bowie we have up on the screen for those that are listening.

Sheryl McCollum: Um, I mean, quite possibly you’re talking about in the [00:18:00] right when she first got into the park. I think there’s probably a good chance because of the direction she ran in. I think if that person had approached her from the front and grabbed her dog, I think she would have ran back toward the restaurant.

So I think the person was absolutely behind her.

Speaker 3: Okay.

Sheryl McCollum: And I think they either grabbed the leash or grabbed Bowie by the collar, um, and did whatever they did to Bowie very quickly. And I think that probably freaked her out enough. She didn’t know what to do, maybe for a split second. And then she ran and she ran with probably no direction really in mind, except away from him, which was behind her between the street and the gate.

Anne Angelo Webb: And so, so speaking of Bowie, do you, and, you know, I guess they’re not going to, you know, as you said, they’re not going to give out too much information for good reason, but, um, His necropsy was not released, but, um, potentially what could come from, for instance, from Bowie’s defensive [00:19:00] bites or maybe scratches or,

Sheryl McCollum: you know,

Anne Angelo Webb: if

Sheryl McCollum: he was able to bite the person, um, they could swap his mouth and get DNA for sure.

If the person picked him up by the collar, they could possibly get touched DNA. Um, On the leash, the exact same thing. So again, whatever they did to Bowie, and you’re talking about a pretty, you know, strong animal.

Anne Angelo Webb: Yeah, Bowie’s a pit bull, by the way, if you’re listening. Yeah.

Sheryl McCollum: And so, I doubt that he was strangled, because that would take longer, and she would have been further from where Bowie was found.

if that makes sense to y’all.

Speaker 3: So

Sheryl McCollum: I don’t think this person took a lot of time with him. I think it was very quick. I think the decision was, I got to get this dog out of my way and I’ve got to do it fast. Um, and again, I know you’ve got people that are listening. It’s sensitive, but I’m just saying for me from a forensic standpoint, if I had to guess, he grabbed the dog and, [00:20:00] you know, cut his throat very quickly and she took off and he caught her within.

I mean, it was yards. It wasn’t maybe. 25, 30 yards.

Anne Angelo Webb: Yeah. It’s incredibly brazen to, I mean, because he could have bit him. I mean, he could have done damage before he had a chance. Absolutely.

Sheryl McCollum: You

Anne Angelo Webb: know, it’s,

Sheryl McCollum: yeah. And from what I learned from Emma, he was very protective. So even the first time he’s grabbed and try to get control, he might’ve reacted very quickly for sure.

Anne Angelo Webb: Yeah. I hope that they do have something it. And so it is also kind of incredible. We haven’t heard about anything like this since then. Yes. Or before, I guess. I don’t, I don’t know. Is that surprising that in these three years, nothing similar? Well,

Sheryl McCollum: I have a short answer and then I have another answer. The short answer is yes.

It is shocking. Because I [00:21:00] think in the beginning, we all thought. When Atlanta starts looking in every other state, there’s going to be a similar transaction somewhere, right? That never transpired. So then we thought, well, there’s no way with this level of violence he’s done. And there’s no way this was his first time, is what you’re thinking, right?

But then, you know, you have to remind yourself of somebody like Ted Bundy. Ted Bundy strangled women with their own pantyhose. And then In the Omega house, he picked up a log and bludgeoned them with a log that was outside, not even something he brought with him. Well, that doesn’t look like the same person, but it’s the same person.

So is he out there committing different crimes and we’re missing it? Possibly. Possibly. So again, I hate to give that answer because it’s not a great answer, but it’s the truth. And when all of us sit in a room, that’s the kind of things that we toss around. Is [00:22:00] this guy? walking among us and he’s dormant right now, which could also happen.

There are people that have been dormant for 10 years. So is that what’s happening? Is he in jail for something else? Because they found him with cocaine or something on him. So he’s in jail for three years and we just hadn’t heard from him. I don’t know. But I will tell you this. Um, I do know the Atlanta police department.

Well, I know, you know, a lot of their folks in homicide. This thing is not out of their mind. They are thinking about Katie and Bowie constantly. They are still walking the park. They’ll still drive by there. If they get an alert from anywhere, they check it out. If they get a tip, they check it out. So I can tell you that.

And that’s with, I think a lot of people in Fulton County, like my police department is in Fulton County. But if we were to hear something or find a dog harmed in some way, and something carved, we’d call them immediately. [00:23:00]

Anne Angelo Webb: So this wouldn’t be considered a cold case at this point, it’s still?

Sheryl McCollum: Well, it depends on your definition.

So every department sometimes has a different definition. Ours is three years with no new leads or activity. So once you hit that three year mark, and people aren’t calling tips, and you haven’t found anything new, and you haven’t gotten any evidence back. That points in one direction or another, or the BAU hasn’t said, Hey, I think we can connect this other case in Kansas when that hasn’t happened.

You’ve got a cold case.

Anne Angelo Webb: Okay, well, let’s hope not. I hope, you know, especially with, because it is the coming around to the same time, the July, you know? Mm-Hmm. maybe with a, I think another, I, I think I saw another, um, podcast. Um, not so much YouTubers but podcast did, um, a two-parter on this, so I hope. Some kind of new leads come in or anything to help them.

There is also this um, [00:24:00] Let me bring it up on the screen. If people, Ah, This is Footage If it’s going to let me share it. It’s not gonna let me do it. We’re gonna, I had a feeling I was gonna have a problem with that. I had some footage to show of the park, um, of people leaving the park. And I don’t know if everybody, I know there was a jogger that for some reason is not letting me show.

But, um, a jogger they did speak to who they caught coming out of like that exit where there was that camera leaving the park. Um, but there was A few other people, you know, and hopefully it’s such a big case. Hopefully all of them have come forward to if they had any information, but

Sheryl McCollum: well, here’s the reality.

And you can, anybody listening, you can go find this easily and watch it. There is no way that killer wasn’t saturated with blood. So none of the people leaving the [00:25:00] park would be the killer

Speaker 3: that

Sheryl McCollum: we saw. So, you know, there’s also. A few ways you can get in and out of that park without going through the gate.

So, maybe he stayed in the park all night.

Anne Angelo Webb: Maybe he was

Sheryl McCollum: living in the park. Again, we don’t know. Yeah. We don’t know.

Anne Angelo Webb: That’s a scary thought. Um, I, I’m assuming you, if you had the knowledge of this, cause I, I know this information hasn’t been released, that you probably can’t reveal it, but any DNA found or can you elaborate?

Um,

Sheryl McCollum: no.

Anne Angelo Webb: Yeah. Okay. Um, I’m not

Sheryl McCollum: saying no to DNA. I’m saying I don’t have the knowledge to elaborate.

Anne Angelo Webb: Yeah.

Sheryl McCollum: And again, there’s a reason they keep things close to the vest y’all. Um, And it like, for example, what happened to Katie versus what happened to Bowie, we don’t [00:26:00] need to know what happened to Bowie because when they catch somebody and that person blurts out the right answer, then, you know, like let’s say they capture somebody and they’re talking to them and the guy goes, well, I didn’t strangle that dog.

They never said the dog was strangled or why didn’t gut him? That was never said. So if you say that, then you have knowledge that you shouldn’t have. So. Does that make sense?

Anne Angelo Webb: I certainly think it does. Yes. Thanks. Okay. Um, so.

Sheryl McCollum: You’re welcome.

Anne Angelo Webb: Um,

Sheryl McCollum: That’s a cool little effect where it flies across the screen.

Anne Angelo Webb: Yeah, it thinks it’s going in the right place now. I don’t know why before it was. I’ve been on other

Sheryl McCollum: things where they’re like, oh, people are in the chat room, but I can’t ever see anything. So I don’t know if they’re going, you know, she’s an idiot. I can’t see it. So I just keep talking.

Anne Angelo Webb: [00:27:00] Yeah. No, no, nobody’s saying that for sure. Um,

Sheryl McCollum: yeah.

Anne Angelo Webb: And if people do have questions again, feel free to, to post those and, and I mean, if I know it, I’ll, I’ll answer it if I know it. Yeah. And also please do like share, subscribe if you find any information helpful and we do, but I want to be

Sheryl McCollum: clear again, this was not my case.

I worked at only for the sake of TV, um, and you know, and to help if we could, but you know, it was just, especially at the time because everybody was real upset. Like, is this guy living among us? Is he in the park? Is he going to strike again? So, you know, and you’re talking about a community, it is really rare, um, that you have a murder in this type of, situation where again, people are out and about.

I mean, she just left a restaurant that was full of people. So I’m telling you again, it’s not like she was cutting down some alley in, you know, the [00:28:00] dark a night all alone. I mean, she did something she had done a thousand times and, you know, she’s in a community that for the most part is extremely safe.

Anne Angelo Webb: And not to mention she had her dog who’s not just a little floof, you know, that’s right. That’s right. I, I now, because of this case, I walk, you know, I have a German shepherd and I have a a medium sized dog, but now I just think, well, I, you know, he’s, he’s a good protector, but for people maybe coming in, I don’t know.

I don’t, I don’t take risks with him because I don’t want something to happen to him. Not that that was her fault. Not that she could have known that, Oh,

Sheryl McCollum: not at all. Not at all. And again, you don’t know what his mind was. If he was seeing visions, he might not even have known that was a dog. Who knows?

Anne Angelo Webb: Yeah.

So, right. You know, poor Bowie, poor Katie. I, um, and I asked to feel my heart goes out to Emma and, and her family and just, but to find. [00:29:00] That scenario, and I think, I mean, also I’m sure there’s people this kind of on the last, the last one, I, I think I felt kind of bad because I think I blocked someone who kept mentioning this, but I just, of course, not that I know anything, but my assumption, partly because of what happened to Bowie is that, you know, people who, who might be trying to say that, um, Emma had something to do with this, to me, that seems, you know, Pretty out there, but I don’t, I don’t know it.

Sheryl McCollum: Well, Bowie was her dog. Yeah, that’s, so, first of all, she would’ve killed the other dog, , , because they had two dogs. Mm-Hmm. . One was Katie’s and one was Emma’s. Well, Katie was walking. Emma’s dog. Emma’s dog. Okay.

Anne Angelo Webb: Yeah, I know there’s two pictures of dogs and I, I, when I, when I first did this, I think it. A few years ago, someone contacted me, they’re like, you’ve got the wrong dog.

That’s not Bowie. And I was like, Oh, I think I got it right this time.

Sheryl McCollum: And listen, [00:30:00] we don’t have an arrest, so nobody’s necessarily off the table. But again, logically you’re at work. Everybody sees Katie come there. So everybody’s going to know there’s a short window between you seeing her. Did they have an argument?

Did she storm off? Did she slap her? Nobody has said that. Everybody said, Oh, she stopped by all the time. It was, it was her routine. That’s what they did. And then if you watch her activity, calling the phone, calling the phone, calling the phone, and then noticing, okay, the phone’s not moving. So she either lost it and she’s out there looking for it.

Well, that’s logical to think if she dropped her phone somewhere in Piedmont Park, she’s going to backtrack looking for it and she can’t get in touch with Emma, but she doesn’t want to leave the phone out there. So that’s kind of what Emma was thinking in the beginning. And then obviously what happened happened.

And then there’s a 911 call. You can hear it and you can make your own decision whether that sounds authentic to [00:31:00] you. Um,

Anne Angelo Webb: yeah, but it would have been a lot and she would have had blood and had to go home and change. Yeah.

Sheryl McCollum: Yeah. Exactly. A lot. Yeah. Exactly. It would have been a lot.

Anne Angelo Webb: Yeah. And number one, the dog.

That’s. And number one, the dog. Yeah. Yep. Um, well, is there anything else that we didn’t touch on that you think is important to mention? Yeah. There’s one

Sheryl McCollum: more thing and this will get rid of anybody looking at Emma. When you have an attack of that magnitude and that violence, chances are she was sexually assaulted.

So that’s why I’m pretty confident saying he.

Speaker 3: Mm

Sheryl McCollum: hmm. Okay. So that Emma wouldn’t be able to do that. She wouldn’t have been able to successfully complete that type of attack. So,

Anne Angelo Webb: yeah.

Sheryl McCollum: Wasn’t her.

Anne Angelo Webb: Yeah. She’s just got to live with this now. So I hope they do catch this person soon. Um, so thank you so much for, for your insight [00:32:00] on that.

Um, also. Just one more thing about that. I didn’t want to mention that, um, there is a bench now in the park, uh, for Katie and Bowie. Um, I guess, I think there’s like a dog park area maybe there, and they have the bench there if you ever want, if anyone ever wants to go and pay their respects. Um, and then also Katie had music, um, that she was working on.

She’s got beautiful voice and she has it on soundcloud. com forward slash Katie dash Janess. J A N N E S S, um, I’ll also link that in the description. So um, and also the Crimestopper info or the crime reporting information. So okay, so let’s, let’s go now to, uh, wanted to talk about this really interesting thing you did.

You went to Either animal poaching or animal trafficking school in Africa. Talk about that. That sounds, yeah.

Sheryl McCollum: Anti [00:33:00] poaching

Anne Angelo Webb: in South Africa.

Sheryl McCollum: Yeah, it was fantastic. I will tell you hands down. I think it’s the best training I’ve ever had in 44 years in this business. Hands down.

Anne Angelo Webb: Wow. And what brought you to that?

How did you end up there?

Sheryl McCollum: Well, um, I have been interested in animal cruelty and specifically Trafficking of exotic animals for years, and there just is not the training on the level that I wanted. And I’m in a position now where I’m kind of thinking of what I’m going to do in retirement. And so I wanted it to be something I was still excited about and I could use my crime scene knowledge.

I don’t want to just put that on a shelf, you know, and I thought, well, I’ll combine the two. And see if I can’t work animal crime scenes and help people understand what has occurred here and try to help solve some of these cases. So I started looking for, um, you know, [00:34:00] those types of classes and I just could not find anything.

And then I stumbled on the, uh, Wildlife Forensic Academy in South Africa. And I contacted them and honey, it was game on. I couldn’t get there quick enough.

Anne Angelo Webb: That’s so cool. What was it like? Like, what, what do they do there?

Sheryl McCollum: Well, I’m assuming everybody on here is an animal lover, right? More than likely. Okay.

So let me just tell you what happened. So I, we have this little, uh, like a cottage almost, and all these cottages are kind of connected and they’re, they’re kind of like that. Where, you know, you have one. So your porch, it’s almost like you’re by yourself, if that makes sense. So they’re kind of lined up, you know, kind of cool.

And the very first night we’re there, I hear something, but I have no idea what it is. You know, I mean, I’m from Georgia. I know certain animals, but I don’t know what I’m hearing. And it’s loud. And it sounds like it’s fast. [00:35:00] And the next thing I know, this herd. Just comes flying by and it’s it’s dark. I can’t tell what it is, but they look dangerous.

That’s all I can tell you. And I was like, this is awesome. So the next morning, there’s all this, you know, evidence that a whole bunch of, you know, animals have come by there and then we go up toward the academy because the academy is on, you know, one whole, you know, you know, I guess you would call it like campus.

And. There’s just a herd of zebra and they’re standing kind of off. It’s the most gorgeous thing I’ve ever seen in my life. And then there’s Rhino and then we have giraffe. And then I’m just like, who would ever leave here? You know? And so I’m thinking, how do I lose my passport? You know, so then, um, Some of the training, like we had, Special forces from South Africa train us on how to, you know, [00:36:00] reverse track and find where the poachers are coming from, not just where they located the animals.

And that was interesting and fascinating. And then we had people from two oceans aquarium that are telling us, how do you get to the number of 350 million animals a year? The ocean, because they are, you know, snagging some of these tiny little, you know, sea creatures and they’re doing it by the millions.

I mean, it’s just crazy. Like, you know, 500, 000 sharks are killed just for their fin. And you know, then you’ve got what they’re doing to the rhino and their horn and you’ve got what they’re doing to elephants for the ivory and then the tiger and it just keeps going on. Well then, you know, you’re standing there talking to, you know, one of the wildlife vets and he says, well, you know, 2035.

There won’t be an African penguin. And I’m like [00:37:00] 30, 35. I mean, we’re, you’re talking about 11 years. And so I’m thinking, I don’t have grandchildren yet. So you’re telling me my grandchildren won’t be able to see an African penguin. Like that is not okay. You know what I mean? And so you start to say, okay, what can we do to help these animals?

Well, here’s the really cool part. This is an organized crime. And they do things like they barter. So sometimes they will go into the poorest communities and say, Hey, y’all have no money. You got nothing going on. We’re going to pay you in cash or in cocaine. Cause again, they’re organized criminals. So then you’ve got these folks that have nothing and all you want me to do is go down there and get a bunch of turtles or, okay, I’ll be right back.

So now they’ve got money where they would never have that. So they barter some, they launder money, and [00:38:00] then they actually take the animals. And there’s one or two things you can do. You’re either selling the animal live because this person wants it because it’s so rare. So if you live wherever and you want a panther or you want a you know, a tiger, they’ll go get it.

And the other thing they do is kill the animal for the parts. If somebody wants a paw or teeth or claws or the fur, and that’s what they’re doing. And, you know, we’re not talking about the hunting that is legal. If you have done something and you put together a trip and it’s completely illegal, I’m not talking about that.

I’m talking about when you sneak onto an animal preserve and it’s like fish in a barrel. And you know these tigers are there, and you know these zebras are there, and you go in there on private land and kill them. That’s the deal. So you just think of the mob. So, you know, people think, oh, you know, a pimp.

You think a pimp runs women. And you think that’s [00:39:00] all they do. That’s not all they do. They got drugs. They got guns. They’re gonna, you know, launder money as well. They’re going to be about whatever makes them money. So they’re not going to say, Hey, I’m only going to deal in elephants. So if the tiger is going to make more money, or the, you know, the terrapin turtle, that’s what they’re going to be about.

Right.

Anne Angelo Webb: And is this, this getting bigger and bigger, this trend?

Sheryl McCollum: The black market’s not going anywhere. But here’s the other good thing, because I like to tell the positive too. The routes that these folks take for animal trafficking are the same routes that human traffickers take. So if we can bust up some of these routes, not only are we saving animals, we’re saving a lot of women and children and men.

Anne Angelo Webb: So in other words, do they traffic them in the same, like route? [00:40:00] Vehicle, vessel, whatever, however they get, they’re all crowded in, they’re all together. And then, um, correct. Okay.

Sheryl McCollum: So you can have an animal that you capture in South Africa and it can be in Malaysia within 24 hours. Wow. Well, human beings are the same.

So like when you see a woman that’s missing and you say, Oh, well she went missing from Orlando, Florida. She could also be in Malaysia just that quick. So you want to bust these things up. So anywhere you have a port for ships, railroad, a busy airport, those are the things you’ve got to make sure people understand.

So you’ve got airports. They don’t even have dogs that can locate these animals. They’ve got dogs that do drugs and bombs, but there are animals that can go in there and say, Hey, that suitcase. You know, they’ve got turtles, that suitcase has got, you know, whatever they’re looking for. [00:41:00] And it’s pretty remarkable to watch those animals work, honey.

Anne Angelo Webb: Yeah. Yeah. And I actually saw, um, a little thing when I was doing a little bit of research on this on YouTube, there was a small little thing about some technology they have that can, as things are coming through, they, they’re beginning to be able to like, very quickly. identify what those animals are. And unfortunately a lot, they’re seeing like deceased animals in these cases that are coming through, but they’re taking those images and immediately, like within seconds, they can replicate it so that if the same one comes through a few seconds later, now the computer system, the technology immediately.

It picks up. That’s sure. This crazy name. You know,

Sheryl McCollum: and here’s one thing I learned that blew my mind, and again, some of your folks probably know this, but I didn’t know it, you know, how you have ever been to like a, [00:42:00] um, garden? Sometimes they will have those butterflies in the cases. Mm-Hmm. where you can see, oh, this is the, you know, monarch, this is the purple African, you know, butterfly.

People collect all kinds of insects and bugs to the point there was a person that was going to Africa and collecting this beetle. And this beetle was so rare, this guy would find, you know, their habitat and he would scoop up like 100, 200. And he was putting them in literally just a Tupperware case and sealing it.

He didn’t care that they died because he was selling them to people for their collection because you could not, it’s not legal to take this beetle out of Africa, but he was doing it. So that’s the kind of thing I’m sitting there going, you’re paying thousands of dollars for a dead beetle? But yes, because those collectors are that serious, that’s the only beetle they don’t have, so they’re going to pay for it.

Oh my gosh. And you just sit [00:43:00] there and I know several, several years ago, there was a insect museum. I want to say it was in Philly, but don’t quote me, but they had a huge burglary. Somebody goes in and steals all these insects, like an eight eyed spider and all these different, you know, little things that I didn’t know anything about, but I became immediately captivated because like, I don’t know anything about it, but if there’s a museum, then there’s money, there’s money in it, which means the black market’s got to be involved.

So I wrote a story for Crime Online about it, but I couldn’t get anybody interested. I couldn’t get anybody mad. I couldn’t get anybody going, wait a minute, this had to be an inside job. Who else would know that and know that it didn’t matter if they lived or died, they’d still make money. Some of those little things were so rare that that museum couldn’t even replace them.

Anne Angelo Webb: Oh my gosh. I couldn’t. And from, from what I watched, almost, It seems like [00:44:00] even with like these, like turtles and like these kind of special types of snakes and different things, they, they could, there’s no way they could have lived the, survived the trip. And it’s like, well, they must have known that. So yeah.

And just heartlessly letting these animals just, but, and they

Sheryl McCollum: would suffer because they’re suffocating. I mean, it’s terrible.

Anne Angelo Webb: It’s terrible.

Sheryl McCollum: It’s terrible.

Anne Angelo Webb: And who in the world, how can there be so many people that would want a deceased turtle, like, or whatever? Like it’s bizarre. And I think

Sheryl McCollum: that’s where some education has got to come in because there are people that believe the rhino horn has, you know, medical purpose.

Anne Angelo Webb: Yeah. And then there’s

Sheryl McCollum: other people that believe it has like, you know, It has the same effect as like oysters, right? That’s asinine, but it takes training because the lye gets out there first. And you know, it’s hard to get that back once it’s [00:45:00] out there. So there’s all these folks that are like, Oh, I want a drink.

And I can’t remember the price, but y’all can research it. It is ridiculous that at these clubs, they take these rhino horns and grind them up and literally put them. In these cocktails and people are drinking them at these clubs just to kind of show how much money they have,

Anne Angelo Webb: right? Yeah. Yeah. It’s like Okay.

Yeah, like shark fins Correct

Sheryl McCollum: the exact same and you may again I had the impression maybe you know 50, 000 sharks But it’s 500, 000 like that is nuts. So if you look at your ecosystem, we’re going to be in real trouble because we’re not, you know, every little animal has some part to play and if you bust that up, you’re going to lose something, right?

Anne Angelo Webb: Yeah. So. And do you find that, or have you learned anything [00:46:00] about like, is there a part of this country in the United States where they’re coming in more? Yeah.

Sheryl McCollum: That’s why I mentioned the busiest airport. So Chicago, Atlanta, you have to look there just like human trafficking. They are coming through those airports.

So if you’re not arresting somebody just about every other day, you’re missing it because they’re moving them. They’re moving out of all. And there’s some things that are great. Y’all like I had a nephew and his wife went into labor early. So my children at the time, they were 16 and 18. And my son, this is relevant to the story, but he had a full beard.

Um, even in high school, because he was like, Hey, I could grow it. So, you know, he wanted to show that off. And my daughter is little for her age. She’s, she’s tiny and she looks young. She looks younger than she is. So even though she was 16, she probably looked 13. He probably looked 20. [00:47:00] My husband and I could not go down to Savannah, Georgia when they could.

So they went early because they wanted to see the baby. They were so excited. So my husband said, this is great. And I will get y’all a room at the Hilton will be a day or so behind y’all. And the Hilton at the time had a QR code. And so all my husband just sent it to my son’s phone. When my son got to the room, he put it up to the door, the door open.

They never even had to go in the lobby. They never had to go to the front desk. So nobody was, you know, making sure you 25, you can’t rent a hotel room, that sort of thing. They walked right in and got in the elevator and went up. But I told my husband, anybody watching that should have been like, it doesn’t look right.

Like he, she looks like a child,

Speaker 3: but

Sheryl McCollum: anybody that was a pimp or a human trafficker, They don’t have to go to the front desk either.

Speaker 3: They would

Sheryl McCollum: have the same QR code. So it’s one of those things I was happy about [00:48:00] for my children, because they got to go on and celebrate with the baby. But my mind was clicking the whole time going, what devil thought of this?

You know, but

Anne Angelo Webb: there you go. Um, so it sounds like our, our government, hopefully our, our, um, Whoever it would be, whatever division of our, um, I can’t think of the word, not police, not military, but you know, whatever, who would ever be looking for this would be, it’s becoming a, uh, a tie in where they really are trying to address this problem of

Sheryl McCollum: Well, I think you’re right.

I think it’s a lot of people. I think the coast guard is involved. I think we’ll just say Because I can’t you’re right You’re 100 right, but like airlines are clearly involved They’ve done a lot of great training with their flight attendants and pilots hotels have done a great job. Um, But you know, we don’t have a choice because it’s that prevalent

Anne Angelo Webb: You know,

Speaker 3: [00:49:00] okay

Anne Angelo Webb: Um And is so is this something at this point?

This is something right now you’re not working on in particular cases. This is something kind of down the line that you’re

Sheryl McCollum: it’s down the line. I’m I’m trying to get it going. I literally. In March is when I had the training. So what we’re doing now is we’re trying to support the wildlife forensic academy in any way we can.

And that’s with experts that’s with, you know, trying to raise funds for them. Cause they’ve got a lot of Rangers out there that don’t have the equipment they need. And like one thing that we did was. You know, crime scene markers are small, right? You’ve all seen those pictures where you might have 17 things lined all up so you can get them in one picture, but you don’t know what it is.

Is it a cigarette butt or a shell casing or a drop of blood? You just see those yellow things, right?

Speaker 3: Yeah.

Sheryl McCollum: So one thing as a group, we all looked at and we had tons of experts kind of do a peer review and make sure this is the right thing. But we did crime scene markers that are about the [00:50:00] size of. Um, a for sale sign, a small for sale sign, and it’s got an animal paw, it’s got blood splatter, it’s got a dart, it’s got a gun, it’s got a footprint.

So from a distance in a wide open space like South Africa, if an animal is killed, you can see what transpired from a distance. So there’s things like that we’re trying to help them, you know, get so that they can move more of these cases through the court system. Because right now, less than like 15 percent are even prosecuted.

Okay.

Anne Angelo Webb: And we have a question. Are dogs specialized to smell poached animal parts?

Sheryl McCollum: Yes. Yes. These dogs are unbelievable. But they’re taught to smell, you know, tigers and elephants and turtles and shrimp and all these different things. Yeah. They’re called conservation dogs.

Anne Angelo Webb: Oh, okay. Yeah, they are fabulous.

Sheryl McCollum: I want one.

Anne Angelo Webb: What kind of dogs are those? Do you, are they a specific breed or? [00:51:00]

Sheryl McCollum: Yeah, from what I saw, they were different breeds. So it’s like any other dog. You can teach them to, you know, connect cocaine or gunpowder. So they’re doing the same thing. So it could be a beagle or a shepherd or a Malinois, whatever. Have you,

Anne Angelo Webb: I don’t know, have you seen that?

There’s a short, it comes up on YouTube. In my husband’s eyes. It came up again. We’d seen it like months ago, and they came up again. We were both laughing. We kept replaying it There’s a German shepherd and says he’s a retired police dog And he’s like looking out the window and the guy is saying to the dog Like a grocery list like I’m gonna you know, I’m gonna go to the store I’m gonna get you know milk cheese Um, you know, he just starts listing off all these things and then the guy goes, cocaine and the dog’s head whips around.

It’s so funny. It’s fabulous. It’s the cutest thing. Um, big, [00:52:00] gorgeous German shepherd too. Um, I love German shepherds, I have a thing, but, um, so, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, um, Information. Okay. So I did just a couple more questions. We’re going to let you out of here. I know we were given in an hour, but um, what can people do about this?

Is there, what role can people play in the public about trying to help with these issues?

Sheryl McCollum: Sure. Well, again, you can contact the Wildlife Forensic Academy. You can donate, you can get trained, you can become a volunteer. You know, somebody that champions their cause to say, look, y’all, I had no idea 350 million animals a year.

So Yeah, we’re gonna have some real damage pretty soon. No matter where you live in the United States There is some animal being trafficked whether it’s a turtle or a bear or a pig So, find out from your local, like, [00:53:00] DNR, you know, your wildlife, you know, police, find out, you know, are people harming fish hatcheries?

Are they going after, you know, certain deer, like in Key West, those little key deer, anything that’s rare, you know, so that’s, that would be one thing. I think the second thing is talk about it, post about it, because people don’t know. I can’t, I can’t imagine

Anne Angelo Webb: what’s in Jersey that anybody would want like around here.

I don’t know. We might be the one, the one state that’s excluded. I don’t know.

Sheryl McCollum: But you’ve got the ocean. So of course it’s right there, you know, and you’ve got people that do like the whale watching and they’ve, they’ve got different things and that means somebody could get that same thing and harm something.

So yeah, of course. Absolutely. I just saw someone was

Anne Angelo Webb: fine.

Sheryl McCollum: Oh, I’m so sorry. I’ve got something else. You said Jersey, the garden state. This [00:54:00] blew my mind. I hate to keep telling your people. I don’t know anything, but I didn’t know this. So I’m just telling y’all. I was like, what? So the other thing that people poach are plants.

which also directly harm animals. So they will, they will go and get these cacti that are 200 years old. And there’s all these plants in South Africa. Some of them have, you know, medical purpose, but some of them are just beautiful and extremely rare. So they will get these plants, dig them all up and then ship them to whoever their fence is that, you know, lets people buy them.

So you’re walking through somebody’s yard and go, man, I’ve never seen a tree like that. I know, cause there’s only four in the whole world and I own one of them. I mean, it’s nuts. It’s nuts, but plants. So again, the garden state, I guarantee you, you’ve got some plants that are only in New Jersey that somebody in Wisconsin is going to want and somebody will go steal it.

Anne Angelo Webb: That’s crazy. Yeah. [00:55:00] It’s hard to believe all this is going on. It’s like, yeah. How do people even have the time sometimes I wonder for to even like I guess I guess when you have a ton of money. This is maybe what what happens. This is the downside

Sheryl McCollum: But there’s so many legal things I would want if I had a ton of money.

I

Anne Angelo Webb: don’t need Exactly Well, um Tell us a little bit about your podcast So many seven

Sheryl McCollum: It’s zone seven. And the reason I called it zone seven is Atlanta. We have six police zones. So back in the day, before cell phones and before pagers, if we wanted to meet up after work, we would have to go on the radio and say everybody 59 at zone seven at the end of shift.

So people listening to scanners or You know, our superiors, they wouldn’t know what we were saying instead of saying, Hey, y’all, we’re all going to go to the [00:56:00] bar after work. So zone seven was manuals tavern to us. And so what happened was the more we would all meet, we would tell stories. We would get advice.

We would hear other people tell stories and learn better ways to do things. So the zone seven for me. At some point stopped being a, you know, a bar and started being a way of life. So I started to see, wait a minute, you know, these people have my back. They want me to be successful. They’re, they’re going to tell me the truth.

If I’m at a line, I’m at a line. If I’m out of bounds, I’m out of bounds. And if I need to start doing something a different way so that I don’t get in trouble, um, they’re going to let me know that if I’m doing great, they’re going to let me know that, you know, so, you know, those people that truly are your inner circle.

And so that’s why I called it zone seven, because the people that I have on the show typically are in my zone seven.

Anne Angelo Webb: Okay. [00:57:00] Got it. And if that makes it, yeah. And it’s a great show and it’s just a lot of heart in it. Um, she has a lot of great guests too. And it’s on all the channels, you know, Spotify, Apple, I heart radio, probably a bunch of other places.

So you can find it easily. Um, yeah,

Sheryl McCollum: you would know something funny. Because, you know, your audience is, I’m probably very new to them. I don’t, I don’t have this opportunity to talk to animal folks very often. But, um, Michael Vick was a football player in Atlanta and he got in trouble for the dog fighting and all that.

Speaker 3: Yeah.

Sheryl McCollum: There’s a jersey A friend of mine sent me and you know, his last name is Vic

Speaker 3: and

Sheryl McCollum: they had added con and

Anne Angelo Webb: I was like,

Sheryl McCollum: I want that Jersey so bad.

Anne Angelo Webb: I actually got to, when I was in massage school, I got to massage. They had some of those dogs in, um, I [00:58:00] had a class down in DC area and they had them at this, um, kind of like a shelter, I guess it was a shelter.

I guess they were keeping them there. I don’t know why they were still there. Maybe it wasn’t that what’s it? I lost track of time, but, um, we got to work on them. So that was a great thing to be able to.

Sheryl McCollum: I didn’t even know that was a thing. So you massage dogs because they’ve had trauma or

Anne Angelo Webb: I don’t know anything.

Yeah, just anything a human would benefit from massage from

Sheryl McCollum: really

Anne Angelo Webb: an animal benefit.

Sheryl McCollum: My dog travelers laying right there. I hope you ain’t hearing that.

Anne Angelo Webb: Well, you know what? I have playlists on here. So, Mom, you can go on and watch the playlists after this and learn how to massage him.

Sheryl McCollum: That’s why all of a sudden, like the cocaine dog, all of a sudden she was like, massage.

Anne Angelo Webb: Yep. Acupressure, too. You can do both.

Sheryl McCollum: Oh. Well, you know, I have seen the chiropractor adjusting the giraffe. [00:59:00] Yeah. And that’s the cutest thing I’ve ever seen. Yeah.

Anne Angelo Webb: Yeah. Fabulous. Fabulous. Yeah. Chiropractic is so good for, for animals. It really is. Anything we can benefit from. Anything, seriously, any relaxation, um, post surgery, pre surgery, immune system support, just really anything animals can, can benefit from.

So. And I want

Sheryl McCollum: everybody to know I’m joking. I would, of course, give her a massage. Okay. Sweet

Anne Angelo Webb: thing. Um, so, and is dogs, I have to ask this, what’s your favorite, favorite animal? Is it dog? In the whole world?

Sheryl McCollum: Uh, I mean, of course I love a dog. I’ve had them my whole life. So it’s probably the one that I’ve been the most exposed to is a dog.

Um, but probably a giraffe. I mean, there’s just something about them. They just don’t even look real to me.

Anne Angelo Webb: Yeah,

Sheryl McCollum: you know,

Anne Angelo Webb: and that was

Sheryl McCollum: the one thing I told my Children before we got to South Africa. I said, I’m just gonna warn y’all. Um, the first time we ever got the Grand Canyon, I cried because I was just so overwhelmed [01:00:00] by it.

I mean, it was tears of just pure joy and just blown away of what I was looking at. And I said, I’m just telling y’all, if I see a giraffe in the wild, I will act a fool. So just, you know, you got to give me a mulligan. And of course, I. That first morning there’s this family of like six and there’s this little baby and I’m standing like literally in the bush I’m just standing and this little baby stopped and was just looking right at me.

I was so close. I could see her eyelashes

Anne Angelo Webb: Oh my gosh, that’s really cool. Yeah,

Sheryl McCollum: I was overwhelmed. Just I mean who would hurt that animal right? I just don’t

Anne Angelo Webb: understand

Sheryl McCollum: Mm hmm. I don’t

Anne Angelo Webb: yeah No, my my massage teacher Um got to massage a giraffe. It was part of like the coming out of surgery that she was under and then as she was coming out, I think it was, or maybe it was as she was going under, probably both, um, to kind of aid on both [01:01:00] ends, but she got to do that.

And just smooth

Sheryl McCollum: her. Yeah, that would be amazing. But also, you know, just as a human being, what that would mean to you and you would understand what was happening. They don’t understand. So, I mean, how wonderful.

Anne Angelo Webb: Yeah, exactly. Well, thank you. Yeah. Thank you so much for, for doing this. I really am grateful for your time.

I know you have a very busy schedule. You’re all over the place. You can catch Cheryl on like a million different shows all the time. She’s quite the YouTube star. So, and other, and other, and not just YouTube either. So, um. No, this is

Sheryl McCollum: wonderful. And it was an honor to be with all of you.

Anne Angelo Webb: Oh, thank you. Well, it’s, it’s my honor.

So thank you everyone. And everyone have a wonderful, we have a long weekend coming up, so just be careful out there and God bless everyone and your little, your fur babies for feathered, scaled, etc. And thank you so much to our wonderful Maud. Malmac, you are the best. All right, everybody take care. Thanks y’all.

Have a [01:02:00] great night.

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My older dog Atticus has been having problems with his back legs for a while. Anne was able to help him with pain relief by her expert care and techniques. She even showed us how we can continue this treatment at home. He also seems more cuddly and calm.  Our friend's dog was over yesterday and he did so well with her. My dog’s life has been enhanced by (Anne's) care. Thank you

Lori Lusardi, NJ

Learn How to Telepathically Communicate with Animals!

 My website offers everything from a free meditation and 90 minute animal communication class to in-depth training and animal communicator certification through my Animal Intuitive Academy.

You can also sign up for live or private classes. If you want to start your training right now, my full-length introductory course, Telepathic Animal Communication, Acupressure, and Mindfulness For You and Your Pet! is available for download by clicking here. This class can also be used to qualify as the first level needed to earn Animal Communicator Certification through Animal Intuitive® Academy. 

I encourage you to grab my free class from Animal Intuitive® Academy here! 

Related Posts:

Many pets suffer from seasonal allergies, especially in the United States, as we enter spring. But what if there was a natural way to bring relief? Tonight on the Animal Intuitive Channel, we're exploring the power of acupressure and TuiNa massage for pet allergies. These ancient practices can help your furry friend feel better without adverse side effects, and we'll have fantastic guidance from our guest favorites returning tonight from Tallgrass Animal Acupressure Resources.

Does your dog or cat get stressed out before going to the groomer, vet, or when you leave the house? Learn some easy acupressure and animal communication techniques to help your pet feel calm and relaxed!

Imagine the pet you cherish, the one who brightens your days and fills your heart with joy—the loyal companion who eagerly waits for your return, offering unconditional love and comfort. Now, picture a day when you're faced with a heart-wrenching reality—a choice to surrender your beloved pet to a stranger or face the consequences. If you believe animals are sentient beings, then this is a story you'll want to hear. Watch the video from The Animal Intuitive Channel or read the blog post.

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